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Random Thoughts On A Sunday Morning Updated To 7-28


Yankee4Life

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Dylan, I feel your pain with the pnenomia...I had that when I was 27 and it was absolutely horrible. My sincere wishes that you get better very soon.

Thanks for the well-wishes, DJ. I'm definitely on the road to recovery. It now feels like a really bad cold, much better than before. You're definetly right with the description of "absolutely horrible."

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Thanks for the well-wishes, DJ. I'm definitely on the road to recovery. It now feels like a really bad cold, much better than before. You're definetly right with the description of "absolutely horrible."

Dylan, I hope you get well soon from this. Pneumonia sucks. I had it went I was 13 years old and I had to miss two weeks of school because of it. Thank God I never had it again.

On the other hand, having an upper respitory infection isn't a walk in the park either because that's what I found out that I have. I haven't been here since Sunday afternoon because since that time and all the way until yesterday afternoon around 4 pm I was checked in the hospital. We had no idea what the problem was. All I know is every time I put my head down on the pillow I would suddenly become short of breath, like someone was stepping on me. Finally I consented to go to emergency (I always fight this because I don't like hospitals) and I had to go through a series of tests, including a stress test on my heart. My heart ended up in good condition after all the tests but now I have to take these antibiotics and use a breather to clear up my lungs for awhile. I have no idea at all how the hell I got this.

But at this point I'm more worried about you because I know pneumonia is nothing to play around with. I recall that pneumonia makes it hard to breath too. Try not to go outside while you are recovering. Take care.

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Dylan, I hope you get well soon from this. Pneumonia sucks. I had it went I was 13 years old and I had to miss two weeks of school because of it. Thank God I never had it again.

On the other hand, having an upper respiratory infection isn't a walk in the park either because that's what I found out that I have. I haven't been here since Sunday afternoon because since that time and all the way until yesterday afternoon around 4 pm I was checked in the hospital. We had no idea what the problem was. All I know is every time I put my head down on the pillow I would suddenly become short of breath, like someone was stepping on me. Finally I consented to go to emergency (I always fight this because I don't like hospitals) and I had to go through a series of tests, including a stress test on my heart. My heart ended up in good condition after all the tests but now I have to take these antibiotics and use a breather to clear up my lungs for awhile. I have no idea at all how the hell I got this.

But at this point I'm more worried about you because I know pneumonia is nothing to play around with. I recall that pneumonia makes it hard to breath too. Try not to go outside while you are recovering. Take care.

I hope you get better, Y4L!

Like you, I avoid hospitals. Unfortunately, I had to go to one too as the nearby Walk-In Medical Clinic was closed for March Break. (??!??)

Between the time I was admitted to the time I got home, it was about eight hours. Other patients in the waiting room kept asking me and my mom, "How long have you been waiting?"

I was finally seen by a doctor, who asked me my symptoms (coughing, difficulty breathing, walking, talking, general feeling of weakness, a feeling that weights were pulling my lungs, and mucus coming out of my eyes), and listened to my (dilapidated) breathing. He asked me to get a chest x-ray.

The chest x-ray was pretty quick.

Once the x-rays were finished, he said there was cloudiness in my lungs, and it could be pneumonia, but it's hard to diagnose. He then prescribed me some antibiotics, but I couldn't get any until the next day as the hospital's pharmacy closed at 7:00 pm. (??!??)

I took some of the dreaded Buckley's medicine that night. I think I just fell asleep due to complete exhaustion.

We were able to get my prescription in the morning. Saturday night, however, I coughed constantly from the moment I got into my bed.

Right now, I'm feeling a lot better, although nowhere near 100%. I have an occasional cough, my nose is still congested, and my ears feel like their submerged underwater. I also feel like I've been in a severe fight as just about all my muscles are sore and fatigued.

The mucus has since departed from my eye. We're pretty sure I had pink eye/conjunctivitis as well.

But again, I hope you get better from your upper respiratory infection. I don't know if you guys have the Buckley's Medicines in the US, but they work. The one I took works wonders. You'd probably want to confirm you can take it with your antibotics with a pharmacist.

Get better Y4L, and thanks for the well-wishes.

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Updated to 3-27

...Talk about a culture shock everyone. It has not been above forty degrees since I came home from Hawaii and I have not been outside since the day I was discharged from the hospital. This upper respitory infection thing sucks by the way. (Like I really have to tell any of you this.) Besides coughing a lot I am finding that I am sleeping about twelve hours a day.

...By the way Dylan, thanks for the advice but we do not have Buckley's medicine around here at all. I'm at the point now where I'd try anything.

...It was like almost being on a different website when I got back here. All the talk was about MLB 2k11 and with all the mods I have been seeing for this game, I hope this year's version is better than the other two years combined. And no, I'm not buying it until I hear some good stuff about it except that "it's ok" or 'at least is is better than last year's.'

...Imagine the surprise that was in store for me when I saw that Dennis James made some mods for 2k11. Either I was away for much too long or Dennis filed for free agency and left the Mvp game. :cray:

...To me, MVP is the game the refuses to die. With all the talk about 2k11 now, the biggest news that I read this week was OTBJoel's announcement that the audio mod that he has been working on for years now is 100% done. What this is going to do is give Mvp a facelift in the area it needed the most. Thank you OTBJoel!

...Sergio Mitre got traded recently by the Yankees to Milwaukee for an outfielder that they didn't need. The only reason why they had to dump him instead of Burnett was because of the contract - never mind that Mitre was more consistent last year. This team really worries me this year.

...Opening day is only a few days away in the Bronx but I'll believe it when I see it. No way would I want to be in Yankee Stadium on Thursday unless they let me bring in a few blankets from home. I would just love to talk to the idiot that made the Yankees open up at home on the 31st of March.

...I got better things to do than worry about how millionaire football players and millionaire football owners are going to resolve their differences.

...Bought one of those electronic book readers recently because I was running out of room for books that I own already. From now on I am going digital. It'll take some getting used to.

...Funniest quote of the week by Bill Maher: "Sarah Palin finally heard what happened in Japan. And she's demanding that we invade tsunami. She says that 'these Tsunamians will not get away with this'. :D You can view the youtube clip right here.

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Y4L, hope you didnt miss Dennis and My release of TC27 MLB/Negro Leagues Merged. Im sure you will enjoy that one much more than Tc27 Integrated. Feel better soon friend.

dave

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Hey there Y4L,

Man, I hope you get to feeling better soon…thats strange that you and Dylan have the same birthday and have not been in top form lately. Hope you guys get to feeling good for Opening Day this week.

Also, not to worry my friend…Ill be leaving the MVP game right about the same time I become a Red Sox fan and a Sarah Palin supporter :crazy: . I really like the 2K11 game well enough this year, but I just hate the generic ads in the stadiums and its been pretty easy to re-insert the great ads from last year. All the creative additions by guys like pena1 and DonSpa really gives the game more realism. With that being said, I will NEVER leave the MVP game and all of its possibilities. I actually have the most fun with that game and I cannot get enough of modding all the aspects I can and I try to play at least 1 game a day. I dont know if you saw the 60 loading screens I made for MVP 11 and a new pitch selector/score overlay and of course more stadium updates and other things to come. Also, me and Dave are still going to be doing more unique mods over the next few months. :good:

Yes, those e-book readers are one of the greatest creations out there. I bought one last Spring and it had inspired me to read more books in 1 year than I did in the previous 6 or 7 years. Its amazing that I have a little over 100 books on that thing and it can store much, much more than that. Im sure youll love yours, but yes, it takes a little while to get used to them.

That Bill Maher/Sarah Palin clip was great.

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Hey there Y4L,

Man, I hope you get to feeling better soon…that’s strange that you and Dylan have the same birthday and have not been in top form lately. Hope you guys get to feeling good for Opening Day this week.

That is odd, isn't it? I'm hoping this week there is a bit of improvement for the both of us.

Also, not to worry my friend…I’ll be leaving the MVP game right about the same time I become a Red Sox fan and a Sarah Palin supporter :crazy: . I really like the 2K11 game well enough this year, but I just hate the generic ads in the stadiums and it’s been pretty easy to re-insert the great ads from last year. All the creative additions by guys like pena1 and DonSpa really gives the game more realism. With that being said, I will NEVER leave the MVP game and all of its possibilities. I actually have the most fun with that game and I cannot get enough of modding all the aspects I can and I try to play at least 1 game a day. I don’t know if you saw the 60 loading screens I made for ‘MVP 11’ and a new pitch selector/score overlay and of course more stadium updates and other things to come. Also, me and Dave are still going to be doing more unique mods over the next few months. :good:

I am very happy to learn this Dennis. Thank you. And no, I did not see the 60 loading screens you made for the game. You must have released them while I was gone. I will be sure to check them out.

Yes, those e-book readers are one of the greatest creations out there. I bought one last Spring and it had inspired me to read more books in 1 year than I did in the previous 6 or 7 years. It’s amazing that I have a little over 100 books on that thing and it can store much, much more than that. I’m sure you’ll love yours, but yes, it takes a little while to get used to them.

I already purchased two books for mine and I am sure I will have a lot more before this year is out. I'm really getting adjusted to it well.

That Bill Maher/Sarah Palin clip was great.

I love reading about Palin. She is almost like my daily comedy show. She is always doing or saying something stupid. And I hope she never stops because she alone is going to keep her from being President. The dumb SOB.

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Updated to 4-3

...It's a nice start to the 2011 season and I will leave it at that. To add any un-needed superlatives to this will serve no purpose.

...But I will rave about one thing. It is so nice not seeing Jorge Posada behind the plate anymore for the Yankees. Now maybe we will throw out some runners this year.

...Asking if I am concerned about this little tiff between DirectTV and YES and you will be surprised at what you get for an answer.

...Ok, here's something I don't understand about the Yankees. They said they had "reservations about signing Pedro Feliciano" from the New York Mets during the off season, stating that he made 266 total appearances for the Mets over the last three seasons, which may have lead to his current arm problems right now. (Currently Feliciano is on the DL for most of this month.) Then why sign the guy if you had an idea what might happen? There are enough pitchers on the team already that can't do the job as it is. Right AJ?

...Honestly, what I am paying attention to the most this year with the Yankees is their farm system. The young pitching down there is exciting. And the two catchers (Montero and Romine) are a few steps away from coming to New York.

...Kind of had a bad week. Sarah Palin didn't say anything stupid, mainly because she wasn't interviewed. She'll make up for it this week. That pig needs to be in front of the camera as much as Charlie Sheen needs to be.

...I refuse to eat candy that you have to unwrap. Hershey's kisses, chocolate Easter eggs wrapped in tin foil, etc. I don't have the patience to get past the candy's outer defenses.

...April Fools was two days ago and yet I find it amazing every year to see people falling for obvious hoaxes that websites dream up just to spring on the unsuspecting lot year after year.

...Yeah, 2K11 is out and the bandwagon for that is growing more and more every day. Old pros like DonSpa have returned to bring some sort of respectability to that game. I swear I think that guy's goal is to make every uniform ever made. :) But with all the attention given to that game, one beautiful audio mod by OTBJoel has overshadowed every mod made for 2K11. Biased? Maybe. But what other game can you find a mod that took three long years to make? Only in Mvp can you find such devotion.

...I have been home since March 18th. There hasn't been one day above 40. Even if I wasn't still sick I'd stay inside. Yeah, I'm a wimp.

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Sunny or RAining Y4L why leave teh house when you can watch your damn yankees bash the tigers heads in?

Well, sure. That's a good point. But that only lasts a few hours. I need other things to do. :lol:

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Updated to 4-10

...Can't say anything bad about this week. This is the week we have been waiting for since the Giants put an end to the Rangers last October. I love it when baseball comes back to us. It makes me feel so much better about everything.

...How about the start by Derek Jeter? Pretty good, huh? Hey, he's hitting .233 (7 for 30 with only one extra base hit.) Come on, give him a break. He's only making 20 million this year and that doesn't take you as far as it used to. :huh:

...I got to confess something right now and it's something I kept to myself all this time. When the Cubs told Carlos Silva to get the hell out, I had the awful feeling that the Yankees would sign him and I don't know why I thought this. I mean what the hell did they sign him for? Isn't A.J. Burnett enough for them?

...And why is it I can predict something like this but I can't predict the winning lottery numbers?

...Of course the Red Sox had to get their first win of the year at the expense of the Yankees. You could see that happening a mile away.

...Hey Phil Hughes! Great job so far this year. Keep up the good work.

...I am not going to miss Manny Ramirez one bit. The guy proved to everyone how much of an idiot he is by getting caught yet again by using performance enhancing drugs. If he doesn't care about what he did why should we? And the hell with that "Manny being Manny" bullsh**. The guy didn't care about anyone but himself. And this video by Red Sox talking head Dan Shaughnessy says a lot.

...No matter what this season brings for the Tampa Bay Rays, manager Joe Maddon has to consider it a success because Ramirez won't be there. Something that Terry Francona could very well appreciate. And so would have Joe Torre had he been awake last year.

...Of course something had to ruin opening week and this time it was the pointless and idiotic beating of a Giants fan after the Dodgers opening game in the Dodger parking lot. And all because this guy had the nerve to be a Giant fan. This poor guy may have permanent brain damage because of this. Honestly when I read about this I was surprised that this didn't happen in Philadelphia, the hotbed of good sportsmanship and exemplary fan behavior.

...My wife bought an iPad2. Why? Because it was "cute." :cray:

...They booed him in Detroit, but in Cleveland Charlie Sheen was a huge hit during his stop there on his "tour." Maybe all the jokes made about Cleveland are justified.

...Where else but in this country can an airhead little tramp get knocked up, have a kid, not have to care for him because she was too busy dancing and in the course of time leave the guy that did the job on her, and then get hired by a foundation to spread the word to kids about teen pregnancy prevention ? None other than Teen Mom of the year Bristol Palin, who raked in $262,000 just to tell a bunch of kids who probably were not listening anyway to keep it in their pants? Yeah, I bet she is really sorry she had a kid now.

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Just amazing stuff Y4L, I cant believe that Bristol was paid that much, wouldn't even half that amount been far more than necessary and the other half probably could have gone along way to preventing MORE than one teen pregnancy.

I maybe opening a can of worms but i want to ask, because i dont know if i have a true opinion on the matter yet, but how is Manny taking steroids cheating, if pretty much everyone in MLB was taking them. If most every player was taking them, and they werent against league rules at teh time, then isnt that HOW the game was played rather than cheating how the game was played?

now i think that the whole steroid era is a black mark on the history of the game, but to relegate the great players who played during teh time to the dog pile is to much for me. Bonds, McGwire, Giambi, Clemens, Manny, Sosa, Palmero and alot of others were Great players. If pretty much the rest of the league juiced too, then these guys were teh best of an era, and i think in my mind they still stand up with history. its just to bad that their numbers are skewed, and we cant really fit them in with the true giants of the past becasue of that. I think they would have fit in nicely.

What bothers me the most about the steroid era is 2 things. 1 guys like Alan Trammell didnt get a fair shake at the hall in my mind because of the numbers the guys on roids making the normal numbers of some great players who played in the late 70s and 80s look smaller than they were. I mean trammell had a great career, and his numbers were good. but at the time he should have been getting votes for the hall, guys like arod, and other Shortstops were putting up 1st basemen kind of numbers. .300 40 120 each year they shot up. they made Tram look like a pedestrian when he should have been getting a invitation to make a speech.

The other thing about the roids era is this. Not everyone who played the game in that time was on Juice. there is no prof no alligation no hint that ive heard that that a guy like Jeff Bagwell ever had an injection of anything in his life, and he didnt get very much a a sniff for the hall this year. Thats a shame and its because the voters are just waiting for something to come up on him. But what if they wait 15years, and gasp, nothing ever surfaces? hey lets wait till the guy dies before they realize he never did roids and should have been recognized as an all time great that he was........

Charlie Sheen could die or get elected president, i dont care, he means nothing to me and makes no difference in my life. He came and went from and to Detroit I wouldnt have known it if i hadnt read it here.

earthquakes tsunamis hurricanes and revolution after revolution around the world. If these things arent enough to make you think 2x about the Mayan Calendar proficies, how about this:

Cleveland Indians in first, Royals are in 3rd 1 GB

you got Baltimore in 1st and Toronto in 3rd 1GB

i see Cincinatti in first, with FREAKIN PITTSBURGH in 2nd 1GB

and teh TEXAS RANGERS were in the World Series last year.

just sayin, looks like the end of the world to me guys.

well, thats enough for me for today. take care all

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Hey Dave,

You have some great points about the steroid era; but Manny is a cheater because he was caught doing this crap for the 2nd time in 2 years when restrictions are the toughest…not in the classic steroid era when many players had a free pass with it. Manny is also garbage (and absolutely stupid) because he was trying to prolong his career by ripping one year contracts from the Dodgers (prior to the 2009 season) and getting caught…then he tries the same crap with the Rays this year. He was on a freefall of diminished skills and now hes probably jeopardized his chances in the Hall because of stupid greed and not riding it out like a regular guy.

I agree with your point that obviously not all players of the late 80s and 90s and forward were roiding. I think there were thankfully plenty of class guys with gobs of talent that didnt fall into that trap like Bagwell,(you mentioned), Griffey, Mattingly, Larkin, Jeter, Bernie Williams and even solid players like Mark Grace. So, my point is that obviously everyone wasnt doing it and well probably never know the correct percentages of those who were…with that being said, all those roiders you mentioned dont mean anything in my book and I could give a s%#t if they get into the Hall. They are all grown men who made their decisions and I do not sympathize. About the only roider Ill give 2 points to is Andy Pettite because I think to date, he was the only player to at least admit it immediately and not lie about it like these other morons. Great points Dave. :good:

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I have to say you right about Manny cheating well after rules were in place. As to whether or not a guy like Bonds or McGwire get into the Hall, i dont care either. The Hall of Fame is not truely what it should be as it has a good number of players who dont belong, and through the ages, a number of players who arent in that should be. But I think that when it comes to telling my kids about baseball players in stories and such, im not going ignore the great accomplishments of these guys. Everyone knew these guys were juicing, the owners, they loved it, for every homerun Barry hit, you think the Giants owners werent just tickled green? They were. and they werent going to tell these guys not to juice, the owners made far more money off of steroids than the players did, I guarantee that. The stadiums were packed to see guys like Sosa and McGwire and Bonds go deep. Every night. I did hate to see these all time greats players being passed in the record books left and right though. But then you have guys like Mike Schmidt who I heard in an interview once say, hell if they had steroids when i played I would have done them too. So i dont want to cast off these players and try and pretend they never played, or even worse make them out to be these evil villains.....(well maybe Bonds) the numbers should stand, MLB let them be achieved without trying to stop it until the government made them put rules in place. They should stand and the guys who achieved them should be able to stand up also, but they should be willing to take whatever they get from teh fans. I just hope that the fans realize that roids or not, these guys were great players. they were no poindexters who shot up and became homerun champions........well maybe Brady Anderson, but still..........

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Some one showed me a story once. They typed it up themselves, so there was no link. I have no idea if it was intended to just make a point, or if it were a true story that I had never heard anywhere before... Either way, I always thought it was interesting...

I wish I remember where this was posted so I could put it word for word:

The story basically is this. Babe Ruth's personal physician had from other doctors that there was a "fluid" that could be injected into a player that would make him bigger, stronger, and faster than anyone that was not taking it... The fluid was from a goat's testicles. Babe Ruth started taking injections of it.

You and I both know, that if this is true, that it had probably zero affect on his abilities... Medical science has come so far since the 1920's and 30's... They actually believed it would work... Sure, since it gave him no benefits, he didn't actually cheat... The point is, he tried...

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I just found this little blurb online:

In 1991, Wiley Publishing released a book called The Baseball Hall of Shame's Warped Record Book. The book, which is aimed at 8-12-year-olds, includes a fascinating story about the Babe:

The Bambino fell ill one year attempting to inject himself with extract from a sheep's testes. This effort by more than a few athletes of his era to seek the healing and strengthening properties of testosterone prefigured the craze for steroids. When Ruth fell ill from his attempted enhancement, the media was told that Ruth merely had 'a bellyache.'

EDIT: And this:

As the sporting industry exploded in the 1920s, athletic trainers and their charges immediately saw the possibilities of using his research. Even the Big Bambino himself, Babe Ruth, injected himself with extract from a sheep's testicles, hoping for increased power at the plate (and in the bedroom). He attempted this only once, and it made him incredibly ill; the Yankees covered the story by telling the press that the Babe just had one of his famous bellyaches. Even though the Yankees tend to celebrate all things Babe Ruth, they have never, to my knowledge, had "Sheep Testicles Day" at the stadium.

Interesting article

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I have read teh same stories about Old Hoss Radbourn as well Emath, although they weren't clear as to whether he was trying to improve his stamina on the mound or in the bed.....

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Updated to 4-17

...Pardon me while I don't shed any tears for Barry Bonds, whom this week was found guilty of obstruction of justice in a federal court. Sure it's another bad mark on baseball, but in Bonds' case that is the only mark people really remember him for. And it wouldn't bother me at all if he did jail time.

...It also goes to show how much this place has changed for the worse. Years ago when something like this happened, someone would make a thread and talk about it. And then we'd go back and forth defending Bonds or putting him down. Nothing like this happened in here this time. Same goes for when Manny Ramirez announced his retirement. No threads, no talk about it. It's like baseball talk has all but shriveled up and died in here because all these new people are flooding the forums with inane questions about 2k11, questions that they wouldn't have to ask if they actually stopped to read the game directions or tried to find it themselves. Yeah I know, things change. But when you are on a baseball site and no one talks about baseball, it's frustrating.

...Way to go Josh Hamilton! Blame third base coach Dave Anderson for sending you home when the plate was uncovered on that infield pop up. Forget the fact that it was two big guys colliding into one another at home plate, you'd rather blame someone else for you getting hurt.

...Just watch, during this off season the Rangers will let that third base coach go because of this.

...Never was I more relieved to see that Phil Hughes was placed on the disabled list. God knows what is wrong with this son of a ***** that a kick in the *** won't cure.

...And it's just a matter of time until the lack of pitching is going to sink this Yankee team. We couldn't afford to have Hughes fall apart, but that's what he did. And Burnett is pretty soon going to be pitching like well, himself very soon. The bullpen will have tired arms by the end of June.

...Yeah but Jeter is hitting .240 and only has one extra base hit all year. The perfect guy you want at the top of any order. :facepalm:

...Why are people so worried about the start of the Red Sox? It's like they expected other teams to roll over because of the people they signed in the off season.

...Hey, Nicolas Cage got arrested for domestic abuse and drunkenness. I didn't know he was friends with Charlie Sheen.

...Housewives, retired couples and people that don't know any better are crying in their coffee this week after the news that two of their soap operas have been canceled. Now what will they do?

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yeah Y4L i feel a general lack of baseball talk on this site to be sure, I dont begrudge the 2K folks their right to chat anyway they feel about that game. It make me giggle that the game was being Modded the day it was released though. guys couldnt even play a full game without needing to make it better. top quality coming out of that box.

this site has been dominated by MVp since I have been here, even 2K10 didnt generate much traffic. But at least the site is still open. And there are more TC mods in the works.

I think we chatted up Mannys retirement somewhat in this very thread though. And I think the reason noones talking about Barry, is that its so old. I mean he retired so small time ago, and many of the newer guys here probably never even saw Barry play......to bad to because the guy was a Phenom. Before roids/after roids, whatever, there was not many like him in the history of baseball. And this will be his legacy. Steroid use, Conviction. teams used to walk this guy with the bases loaded they feared him so much, and the newer generation of fans will only know that he used steroids, and lied to the Grand Jury. Shame on Barry Bonds for ruining a career that should have been celebrated.

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Your right Lipp, Clemens and McGiwire and Palmero all make me sad to think they should be counted among the best, and probably never will now. But i wonder why Bonds is on trial and not Palmero, didnt palmero say to teh Grand Jury "I NEVER USED STERIODS PERIOD"? I hope they go after Clemens as well, but Im glad McGwire has less drama about him, even though he looked pathetic saying im not here to talk about the past. At least he never told anyone he didnt do steriods (that i know of) maybe future generations will go lighter on him....

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Heres anouther random thought on a Sunday.

So im looking up player pictures tonight for portraits for our next TC mod. And Im looking up Napoleon Lajoie. Well my 8 year old daughter walks in, and sees teh screen, theres a Picture and words that say Nap Lajoie.

My 8 year old says "hey Napoleon Lajoie (correctly, impressive enough) she says " He was inducted to the Hall of Fame in 1937.

yeah

I look it up sure as hell, shes right.

now I talk baseball with her. lots of stuff. But i dont think i ever said Napoleon Lajoie to her in my life. WTF how does she know THAT?

lol:unsure: I was gonna get cute and ask her what %of the vote he got, but i was afraid she'd know that to......:facepalm:

Im NEVER playing trivial Pursuit with this kid.

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but Im glad McGwire has less drama about him, even though he looked pathetic saying im not here to talk about the past. At least he never told anyone he didnt do steriods (that i know of) maybe future generations will go lighter on him....

Both McGwire and Sosa. I doubt either make the HOF, but neither one really got caught up in all the drama. Sosa 'couldn't speak English', and McGwire didn't want to talk about the past.

I guess we will see what the future holds.

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