Earned runs vs. unearned runs.... part 2

[Gordo]

OK, I know if a baserunner gets on because of a fielder's error, that if he eventually scores, that's an unearned run. But what if a guy gets a legitimate double or triple and the next batter does something like grounds to the SS and he wildly overthrows first, allowing the guy on 2nd or 3rd to score. Is that an earned or unearned run since it was an error on the SS? I'm thinking it's still unearned even though the guy on the extra bag got a legitimate hit.

[Sean O]

It's an ER as long as the guy gets on base without an error. Whatever happens after that doesn't affect the original on-base runner's status.

It really sucks when you're playing a dynasty in mvp with just a single pitcher, since you know you can get screwed because you just allowed a walk or a single.

[DaDonch44]

OK, I know if a baserunner gets on because of a fielder's error, that if he eventually scores, that's an unearned run. But what if a guy gets a legitimate double or triple and the next batter does something like grounds to the SS and he wildly overthrows first, allowing the guy on 2nd or 3rd to score. Is that an earned or unearned run since it was an error on the SS? I'm thinking it's still unearned even though the guy on the extra bag got a legitimate hit.

it depends on how many outs there are...

if there are 2 outs when the play occurs then the run is unearned b/c if the SS would have made the play then the inning would be over. so any runs scored after the error would be unearned.

if there are less than 2 outs, it could be earned b/c if the next batter (after the one who reached on an error) gets a base hit then the runner on 2nd or 3rd might have scored anyways

so it kinda depends on the situation

hope that helped to clarify

[sfgiantsflgators]

the way you figure earned runs is by recreating an inning with scoring plays without the errors. for instance, take this inning:

batter leads off and reaches base safely on an error by the third baseman. the next batter triples to right center, scoring the leadoff man. third batter grounds out to second. fourth batter grounds out to short, runner on third scores. fifth batter strikes out.

in this inning, two runs scored. but zero are earned. the first batter is considered unearned for the reason you mentioned above - he reached base safely due to the error...without the error, he would have grounded out to third base. since the second batter tripled safely, in the recreated inning he is on third with one out. third batter grounds out to second (two outs recreated). then the fourth batter grounds out to shortstop, allowing the runner on third to score. however, in the recreated inning, this would have been the third out, so that run also is unearned - he would not have scored in an errorless inning.

also, if the fifth batter would have homered in the inning instead of striking out, all runs from the point of the fourth batter's ground out on would be unearned since the fourth batter should have been the last out.

to make it more complicated, if a new pitcher comes in after the fifth batter homers, any runs he gives up are earned to him (assuming no further errors are made) but they are unearned to the team.

hope that helped more than confused :D

[All_Star]

^^^ Wouldn't that be 1 ER because the guy who hit the triple would have scored on the groundout?

[All_Star]

to make it more complicated, if a new pitcher comes in after the fifth batter homers, any runs he gives up are earned to him (assuming no further errors are made) but they are unearned to the team.

What the hell >_____<

[sfgiantsflgators]

^^^ Wouldn't that be 1 ER because the guy who hit the triple would have scored on the groundout?

in the inning i drew up, the runner stayed at third on the groundout to second - maybe it was a line drive that short hopped the second baseman making the runner hold at third until he made sure it wasn't caught on the fly; or maybe the infield was in on the play to prevent the run. either way, if the runner stays at third during this play, his run would be unearned since the fourth batter made what should have been the third out.

if the runner at third did make it home on the groundout to second, then yes, his run would be earned.

to make it more complicated, if a new pitcher comes in after the fifth batter homers, any runs he gives up are earned to him (assuming no further errors are made) but they are unearned to the team.

What the hell >_____<

what? don't understand that? wonder why i posted it? if you're just wondering why i mentioned it, i thought i would include that since it deals with earned runs and that's what the thread is about.

[krawhitham]

Are you guys talking about the game or real life?

The game counts a lot of runs as earned that should be unearned

[Darkslide820]

avngres, tell me if these are true:

A runner who gets on base due to an error will always be an UER. ex:

1: E5

2: HR 2 R's, 1 ER

A DP clears the chance of an UER because a runner who got on base due to an error was erased anyways, as he should have been in the first place. ex:

1: E8

2: 4-6-3 giDP

3: HR 1 R, 1 ER

Any runs scored when the inning's Outs + Errors > 2 are UER's. ex:

1: 4-3

2: K

3: K, E2

4: HR 2 R's, 0 ER

[sfgiantsflgators]

talking about real life kraw - i have noticed that about the game though...and also about it's laughable error calls

avngres, tell me if these are true:

A runner who gets on base due to an error will always be an UER. ex:

1: E5

2: HR 2 R's, 1 ER

A DP clears the chance of an UER because a runner who got on base due to an error was erased anyways, as he should have been in the first place. ex:

1: E8

2: 4-6-3 giDP

3: HR 1 R, 1 ER

Any runs scored when the inning's Outs + Errors > 2 are UER's. ex:

1: 4-3

2: K

3: K, E2

4: HR 2 R's, 0 ER

all the above are correct.

[cybernetic]

You know what happened in a game yesterday.. I scaled the wall to rob a home run and did yet the game ruled it as a double and I had to throw in to stop him from going to 3rd. The game ended up freezing later on in the game so the game never happened.

[All_Star]

Any runs scored when the inning's Outs + Errors > 2 are UER's. ex:

1: 4-3

2: K

3: K, E2

4: HR 2 R's, 0 ER

If it is a wild pitch or passed ball I believe the run is earned still though........

what? don't understand that? wonder why i posted it? if you're just wondering why i mentioned it, i thought i would include that since it deals with earned runs and that's what the thread is about.

I meant is that really the rule? Not why you posted it or anything....

Thats crazy that a releiver comes in and everything resets for him.....

[sfgiantsflgators]

Any runs scored when the inning's Outs + Errors > 2 are UER's. ex:

1: 4-3

2: K

3: K, E2

4: HR 2 R's, 0 ER

If it is a wild pitch or passed ball I believe the run is earned still though........

what? don't understand that? wonder why i posted it? if you're just wondering why i mentioned it, i thought i would include that since it deals with earned runs and that's what the thread is about.

I meant is that really the rule? Not why you posted it or anything....

Thats crazy that a releiver comes in and everything resets for him.....

yep, it's the rule - now if an error happens after the reliever comes in that should have allowed the inning to end, then unearned runs might arise again. and then, again, it will reset if that reliever is pulled.

as for the wild pitch or passed ball, instead of the E2, then yes, you are correct. the runs would be earned.

EDIT: should have read before i hit submit...if the guy strikes out and reaches first on a wild pitch, he would be considered an earned run and the inning is still alive. however, if it's ruled a passed ball, the inning should be over and the runs would be unearned.

sorry for screwing that up :?

[TwentySeven]

yep, it's the rule - now if an error happens after the reliever comes in that should have allowed the inning to end, then unearned runs might arise again. and then, again, it will reset if that reliever is pulled.

as for the wild pitch or passed ball, instead of the E2, then yes, you are correct. the runs would be earned.

Say the situation is as follows: Runner on third, two outs. It's a legitimate hit runner, he reached on a hit.

Passed ball strike three that would end the inning occurs and the runner on third scores, is that earned or unearned?

[sfgiantsflgators]

Say the situation is as follows: Runner on third, two outs. It's a legitimate hit runner, he reached on a hit.

Passed ball strike three that would end the inning occurs and the runner on third scores, is that earned or unearned?

all runners scored on passed balls are unearned - if they score on a wild pitch, they are earned. also, when reconstructing an inning, passed balls are omited just like errors, but wild pitches are considered.

(i fixed my post earlier - i forgot to check it before i submitted it and i screwed up a part of it :roll: )

and, since it was a strikeout that would have ended the inning, and the batter reached because of a passed ball (not a wild pitch), the inning should be considered over and runs allowed the rest of the inning are unearned. if he reached on a wild pitch instead of a passed ball on the third strike, the inning would still be alive.