So Whos The Best Rapper to Grace the Mic?

[MetsReyes777]

Vanilla Ice......Ice, Ice Baby.

Closed. Done. Locked.

Hilarious :lmao:

[JP_Frost]

Instead of having people like Eminem on this list, how about including:

Big Daddy Kane

Kool G. Rap

Slick Rick

Chuck D

Krs-One

Pharaohe Monch (who is top 5 material for me)

Big L

Lord Finesse

Masta Ace

there are probably a dozen more guys i could mention, but any list that doesn't include the names above is flawed.

[MetsReyes777]

KRS-One is cash. That guy is crazy good.

[JP_Frost]

KRS-One is cash. That guy is crazy good.

he used to be, but over the last couple of years, his act had become a little bit tired and outdated.

My vote would go to either Rakim or Big Daddy Kane, because these guys were so far ahead of their time.

EDIT: Also, why in the world is Dr.Dre on this list? he has probably written just a handful of rhymes himself, the rest was ghostwritten.

[ehhh]

You talk about longevity with Nas, how about LL Cool J

To quote Slug...

When I was younger, I wanted to be LL Cool J

Then he started making records for the girls and ****

So I ripped up the Kangol and threw it away

LL has been a pop-star since the mid 90's.

[BigPaPa]

Instead of having people like Eminem on this list, how about including:

Big Daddy Kane

Kool G. Rap

Slick Rick

Chuck D

Krs-One

Pharaohe Monch (who is top 5 material for me)

Big L

Lord Finesse

Masta Ace

there are probably a dozen more guys i could mention, but any list that doesn't include the names above is flawed.

Eminem has had more success and a bigger impact on the industry then any of those guys. Of the top 5 selling rap albums of all time he has 2.

Big Daddy Kane Should be on there but i messed up putting his name in.

As i have stated before to me no one even comes close to Biggie tupac lagged behind him in lyrics and flow. Tupac put out more quality songs, thats true but tupac has more time to do it in. The two albums Big did get out are legendary. Ready To Die Changed rap forever and Life After Death Sold more copies then any single album from anyone else whos been mentioned in this thread and both albums are on Rollingstone's 500 greatest albums of all time list while not one of Tupacs albums are.

On a side note its surprising to me NWA isnt getting any love.

On a differant side note i find it somewaht ironic that the last song Biggie ever recorded was "You're Nobody Til Somebody Kills You"

[Kccitystar]

NWA ushered in the whole gangsta rap thing along with Ice T, which paved the way for Snoop Dogg and the whole West Coast sound

[ehhh]

To me, sales are the last thing you should look at to determine who's a great rapper and what album is great. Same thing goes for Rolling Stones' Top 500 album list. Sorry, but if I want a serious review on hip-hop Rolling Stone is one of the last places I'd look. I'm pretty sure LAD is ranked higher than Illmatic on that list.

Biggie is a tough case, he had one Top 10 album (RTD) but Life After Death was overrated as hell. It's a good album but no where near one of the greatest of all-time. Even The Source said years later that they gave LAD 5-mics simply to make up for the 4-mics they gave Ready To Die.

People like Nas, Common, Jay-Z all had ups-and-downs throughout their career. We have no idea if Biggie would have fallen off or gone pop and started putting out albums filled with "Mo Money, Mo Problems" crossover tracks.

At the same time there's no denying his talent. If you're going just on talent then I'd put him and Nas tied at #1. If you're going on everything (skills, albums, career, etc) he's probably somewhere at the bottom end of the Top 10.

[BigPaPa]

Line for line their no one in the same area code as Biggie.

[MrDudleyDoWright]

LL Cool J

[JP_Frost]

Eminem has had more success and a bigger impact on the industry then any of those guys. Of the top 5 selling rap albums of all time he has 2.

Big Daddy Kane Should be on there but i messed up putting his name in.

As i have stated before to me no one even comes close to Biggie tupac lagged behind him in lyrics and flow. Tupac put out more quality songs, thats true but tupac has more time to do it in. The two albums Big did get out are legendary. Ready To Die Changed rap forever and Life After Death Sold more copies then any single album from anyone else whos been mentioned in this thread and both albums are on Rollingstone's 500 greatest albums of all time list while not one of Tupacs albums are.

On a side note its surprising to me NWA isnt getting any love.

On a differant side note i find it somewaht ironic that the last song Biggie ever recorded was "You're Nobody Til Somebody Kills You"

are you seriously saying that Eminem made a bigger impact on hip hop than Kool G Rap, Kane, Slick Rick and Chuck D?

wow, this explains your list of choices. Either you haven't been listening to hip hop very long, or you've just been paying attention to whatever BET and MTV were hyping up.

[BigPaPa]

Yeah he did. Way way more. He brought millions of people to rap that had never liked it before. Around the time he started getting recognition not only did interest in him go way up but people became interested in all his influences as well and it led to a new wave of interest in Rap.

You are just one of those fuckers who jump on the old school bandwagon blindly without knowing what your talking about. If you wanna express your opinion fine but just do it and Shut the **** up.

[RaptorQuiz]

This entire argument is flawed because the question "Who is the best rapper of all time" is entirely dependent on what each individual feels the requirements are to make someone "best."

There are the people who seem to think this is an exercise in naming people no one has ever heard of, and then mocking other people for only naming artists from the "main stream." This is the typical "I am so underground, I can name important artists you've never heard of."

So, then there's the other side of the argument. If the average rap-fan hasn't heard of them - they can't be that important, can they? This is the typcial "sales and radio-play IS what defines success/greatness. If they aren't a household name, then they aren't in the running for 'greatest' rapper."

For me, personally, I prefer a blend of the two arguments - a middle ground, if possible.

The person doesn't have to be top-40, but I feel that being an underground "influence" for the more modern, more well-known artists does NOT automatically mean someone should be considered among the greatest of all time.

Before there can be a legitimate discussion about who is the "greatest," there would have to be agreement on what defines "greatness." I really don't think there will be agreement on such a concept.

As for my own opinion about the current discussion - I can see the desire by some to look backward to try to find early power-houses (pac, biggie), and then to look back even further to find those people's influences. But I also agree that it's ludicrous to dismiss people like Eminmen - if you deny his influence on the entire hip-hop culture, then you're simply too hung up on the idea that no one who is "popular" can be considered among the greats.

Somebody should remember all the 12-year old girls listening to 2-Pac's "Changes" and Biggie's "Hypnotize" if they forget how top-40 both of those guys were at one point.

[JP_Frost]

why the hostility? feeling offended?

Without those guys Eminem would've been nowhere. The fact that he brought millions of people to hip hop isn't necessarily a good thing either, especially since those people consist mostly of 14-year old boys and girls who will buy anything that's blazing through the charts.

btw, keep your prejudice to yourself, and perhaps check up on some of those names I mentioned instead of looking at album sales and Rolling Stone lists.

[RaptorQuiz]

That proves my point exactly. JP_Frost thinks bringing more fans to hip-hop is bad, since it includes age groups and demographics he clearly doesn't feel belong listening to rap.

And yet, others (like myself) think that's pretty much the POINT of being a recording artist - to bring more attention and fandom to yourself and your style of music. Some people like to equate "success" to "selling out." That is simply a silly way to look at things. Live in the now.

[BigPaPa]

You were the hostel one dumb****.

I know all those guys you named i got more rap on this PC then you could dream of. You dont know me so **** off.

EDITED by RaptorQuiz to remove profanity that made it thru the filter.

[RaptorQuiz]

Whoa. Okay. That's enough. Keep this to a regular discussion - it's rediculous to argue about this - and there will be no more personal attacks or people will be getting some brief mandatory breaks.

[Sean O]

Well, the thing is, I think rapping about bling and crunk and champagne is idiotic and a waste of time. I prefer rappers who actually have to learn flow instead of just waiting for MTV to pick up their story to sell a million albums.

The vast majority of political rappers are underground, because nobody wants to hear anything remotely controversial, outside of the gangsta rap stereotype. plus, there is legit experimentation (Dizzee used to play with all sorts of crazy equipment, including kitchen stuff, to get a unique sound) in the underground that would never be allowed in the mainstream.

In short, I'll Sleep When You're Dead could never be mainstream, since it's difficult and challenging. If he talked about bitches and hos it'd be different.

[JP_Frost]

That proves my point exactly. JP_Frost thinks bringing more fans to hip-hop is bad, since it includes age groups and demographics he clearly doesn't feel belong listening to rap.

And yet, others (like myself) think that's pretty much the POINT of being a recording artist - to bring more attention and fandom to yourself and your style of music. Some people like to equate "success" to "selling out." That is simply a silly way to look at things. Live in the now.

that's not true at all. I'm just saying that record sales don't determine the greatness of a musician or even their influence. Just because millions of people buy a certain album, doesn't mean they are influenced by it or that it has a positive affect on a certain genre. I will admit that I'm more into the lesser known hip hop artists (underground if you will), but for me personally, I feel that if you like a certain kind of music, I think you should try to understand what that music means and how it started. I know alot of people don't do that, but if you want an educated opinion on matters such as the greatest ever, you should atleast know what you're talking about.

Success doesn't mean selling out. Watering down your music to please masses does. I don't feel like getting banned over this or anything like that, but it's pretty hard to not get personal when somebody calls you a dumb**** and brags about his mp3 collection (how about supporting your beloved artists BigPapa by paying for their albums). Apparently it's impossible to have a normal discussion with this guy.

[RaptorQuiz]

You certainly don't need to worry about being banned for anything that is going on right now. And you certainly don't need to hold back with disagreeing with me - you're opinion is your own, and thus always valid.

I was just trying to keep people from getting a little TOO worked up about this, and having a pointless shouting match, when this thread was trying to be a legit discussion about a topic that is obviously interesting to a diverse group of people.

I won't defend BigPaPa's actions, but I won't defend yours either. But that's over (hopefully)... so let's all just get back to regular discussion, instead of heated arguing.

[ronmexico]

that's not true at all. I'm just saying that record sales don't determine the greatness of a musician or even their influence. Just because millions of people buy a certain album, doesn't mean they are influenced by it or that it has a positive affect on a certain genre. I will admit that I'm more into the lesser known hip hop artists (underground if you will), but for me personally, I feel that if you like a certain kind of music, I think you should try to understand what that music means and how it started. I know alot of people don't do that, but if you want an educated opinion on matters such as the greatest ever, you should atleast know what you're talking about.

Success doesn't mean selling out. Watering down your music to please masses does. I don't feel like getting banned over this or anything like that, but it's pretty hard to not get personal when somebody calls you a dumb**** and brags about his mp3 collection (how about supporting your beloved artists BigPapa by paying for their albums). Apparently it's impossible to have a normal discussion with this guy.

I rip all my albums to mp3, I support them.

[BigPaPa]

Apparently you don't know what "Normal Conversation" is because it usually doesn't involve you telling me how i think, What i watch on tv, or why i think what i think.

Im done but i didn't come outa the blue with insults. So how about uh minding your own business and talking about Rap and Not Labeling people you dont know?

[JP_Frost]

yeah that's possible too Ronmexico, didn't think about that.

anyway, if people feel that some of the names I mentioned was just to name names noone ever heard of, then it's probably best for me to not discuss this any further. I was hoping someone would say "Yeah, Lord Finesse is a great mc, but I prefer ..." etc, but if it's truly the case noone knows these names, I will probably come off as elitist or get worked up over it since it's clear some of us disagree about the definition of greatness and/or the level commitment to music.

[RaptorQuiz]

I think Weird Al Yankovic is the greatest rapper of all time.

[timay]

BIZ MARKIE