Stealing Our Work

[udwph]

I am in Tokyo today. I went into a gamer store and was shocked at what I saw. 2ksports MLB 2K11 the OG game bootlegged and next to that game was 2ksports MLB 2K11 Cool Mods from the USA. They are charging 500Y per DVD. All the files in the game came from this site. I have spent the last day going over the Japanese version. Mlb2K11 Korea Mpgm Total Patch is not the only ones doing this and they may have copied it from them.

There are members stealing our work and posting links from this site on other sites to download the files from here. Does anyone care? I sure do!!! I paid to be a member and download from this site. I thought our work was protected and there was a honor between us and who posts and downloads. Now people are stealing our work and posting as their own. Well only a torrent to download from some other sites and connect with their group. 2000+ downloads of a file in less than a week.

"pena1

to tell you the truth I am getting really annoyed as well udwph. You did things the right way and you know how much goes into making mods. To have someone take credit for your work is absolutely frustrating. I wrote the following message to safa a while back and he has yet to respond."

"Yankee4Life

Hello my friend. I don't own 2k11 but I do feel that you have a very legitimate complaint here. Every modder on this website should be secure in the fact that their work is protected on this site, and it is. You know your own work better than anyone since you did it, but how can this website stop those guys from Korea from doing this? It is obvious to me what is going on here based on what you guys are saying. These guys log on here, download your stuff and then go back to their website and repackage it as their own. Damn right it's wrong but how can you stop them from doing this??"

"mcoll86

the quick answer is not going to be necessarily liked, but to protect the originals modder of thi site, if we half to this far is to sav our site owner use a tracking code program or who internal to the site can logging who downloading what and when, then if there q ? of vailaiteding who owns created content, there info to back it. a tracking would be tagging each updoaded with a code number the ony the uploaded and the site would know or tagging the files inbeded id that cant ripped out of the people downloading them, thus a track of proof."

Here is my solution: Would anyone doing mods and uploading their work or downloading our work agree to charge a small fee, a user rights fee to those who download and use our work so they are listed and have bought the right to use our files? Let's say $1.00 dollar? Password protect our work?

We paid to be a member here and to download. tywiggins charges for his editor there is nothing in the Forum Rules that says we can't (unless I missed something).

Let me know your thoughts..................

[mcoll]

i agree with what your say. as a lot of you you i've done stuff for the games over the years, and while i enjoying them all with you and part why i do it, i don't like the idea of being clearly ripped the proper credit of anyone's work. if we do something like what suggested or or find away to tag the files that only the moder creating the file and site admins can id varyify the file for protection reasons, or when a file is uploaded the uploaded contents a automatically generated "Key" like idea that validates who owns the original content, as tracking idea. something like the has marks idea some programs can create as there supposed be singler to the created saved items. this mike be a starting point. the doller idea is good, but the fault there is pay a doller, get the down load, then they could turn do and something with it and still claim its there own. you see the point. its better than nothing. just an extinction of the idea. its something probably needs to be exploded in the group

[Yankee4Life]

I am in Tokyo today. I went into a gamer store and was shocked at what I saw. 2ksports MLB 2K11 the OG game bootlegged and next to that game was 2ksports MLB 2K11 Cool Mods from the USA. They are charging 500Y per DVD. All the files in the game came from this site. I have spent the last day going over the Japanese version. Mlb2K11 Korea Mpgm Total Patch is not the only ones doing this and they may have copied it from them.

Is there any way you can take a picture of that DVD that says "2ksports MLB 2K11 Cool Mods from the USA"? That would be a help.

Here is my solution: Would anyone doing mods and uploading their work or downloading our work agree to charge a small fee, a user rights fee to those who download and use our work so they are listed and have bought the right to use our files? Let's say $1.00 dollar? Password protect our work?

We paid to be a member here and to download. tywiggins charges for his editor there is nothing in the Forum Rules that says we can't (unless I missed something).

Let me know your thoughts..................

Shouldn't there be a better solution that that? Who are the people besides safalove that are doing this? The easiest thing to do is ban them from this site so they don't have access to get any more mods.

[darth_mickrig]

Shouldn't there be a better solution that that? Who are the people besides safalove that are doing this? The easiest thing to do is ban them from this site so they don't have access to get any more mods.

I absolutely agree with Y4L. There must be better ways to do that. First idea is to only upload the raw material for the mods so that every downloader has to do the modding of the file on his own but thats a rather bad idea. Second idea create little installers for the files so that they can't be extracted from the compressed files directly but the mods must be installed in the first place to extract certain files. Third idea introduce a certain post count and period of membership before one can download from here.

[Jim825]

I've been away from the site for a few days and am just now reading about this. A few points here:

I paid to be a member and download from this site.

That's not true. If you made a donation to the site, it was to get unlimited downloads. Trues implemented this as a way to try to raise some money to keep up with the monthly costs to keep the site alive. No one was forced to donate. If they did not donate, they could still download files. They were just limited to 2 downloads per day. Trues did away with this when he moved the site to a new server last year.

Here is my solution: Would anyone doing mods and uploading their work or downloading our work agree to charge a small fee, a user rights fee to those who download and use our work so they are listed and have bought the right to use our files? Let's say $1.00 dollar? Password protect our work?

What will this really do? It means that someone can pay a $1 for your mod, and still pass it off as their own someplace else. How long do you think it will take to make up that $1 that they paid for the mod. Also, the overhead of developing a system like this is going to me too much. Trues is pretty much a hands-off owner here. I oversee it for him, but if we ask him to start putting a lot more work into it, he may just decide to shut it down as being more work than its worth.

I am also against charging for mods. If guys want to do it and they can make money from it, that's fine, but I won't pay for mods and I'll never charge for any of mine. I create mods because I enjoy doing it and want to share with others, not as a way to make money.

mcoll's idea of a tracking code falls into the same category of the password protection system. It's simply too much work to implement and then you have to have someone who regularly monitors download records to see who downloaded the files. With only a limited number of admins here, I don't see anyone (including me) volunteering to take on this work. In the case of safalove, he could have multiple people download files, and there would be no way to trace it to him, since there would be no record of him downloading the file himself.

As someone pointed out, we do have rules on this site about people passing off the work of others as their own, and we have dealt with individuals who have done this. We've also worked with the guys at MLBMods.com and MVPCaribe.com to make sure that someone there doesn't post work that was created by someone here, and vice versa.

Trying to enforce the same rules on other sites, especially non-English sites, is almost impossible unless you get agreement from those site owners to behave in an ethical manner.

Darth's ideas are good ones, however, in my opinion, they will make things too complex for those not overly computer-literate or have some level of modding experience. Most people just want to download mods and then install them without much effort. If you have to get them to start modifying files themselves.

Preventing people from downloading until they reach a certain post count just means that the forums will be flooded with spam so that someone's post count can get high enough. Plus, we have plenty of active members who don't like to post but like to use the mods, so why penalize them?

Do I like this situation? No. Is there anything I can do about it? Not really. About the only thing I can do is ban those people from the site who have been shown to steal work and pass it off as their own. This morning, I banned safalove from MVPMods. It doesn't mean that I've solved the problem, as others working with him could still download mods and give them to him, but at least it's a start....

[Yankee4Life]

There you go everyone. Jim is always the voice of reason and I think he explained things very, very well here. Good going man.

[BSU-FAN]

I agree with Jim as well. Plus if we attempted to sell mods what would stop 2K from suing us for "stealing" their work in the first place? Thats one thing I think people forget; if the developers had never created these games we would have nothing to mod or edit. As a person who understands the crazy amounts of work people put into these...I just hope that credit is properly given to whom ever deserves it. I know that is not always gonna happen and I can live with it. I'm glad that as a community we can ban together to do our part to protect our work best we can and ostracize those that attempt to steal. But beyond that I think we are asking to much. I'm happy that most of these sites including here have tried to do their best at protecting the artists work.

[dennisjames71]

Yes, I agree with every word you said Jim and BSU-FAN made some excellent points as well. Unfortunately in this shrinking world and the ability to access and transmit files at a blink of an eye, we have to basically expect almost anything to happen. If the mammoth Sony Playstation network could be compromised and brought down, pretty much anybody is exposed. Of course I am not pleased that this is happening but I have always been against charging for mods period. Like Jim said, I started to create mods for the games on this site as my way of sharing or “giving back” to MVP Mods. My motto has always been: If my work makes one member happy, then cool…if someone hates my work, then it didn’t cost them a nickel. If I only charged $$ for my work, I guess I would be outraged and refuse to post anything I do…but we sometimes forget that when our stuff hits cyber-land…ANYTHING can be compromised or abused, unfortunately. BSU-Fan also brought up the point I was going to make…that basically game companies and Major League Baseball can lay a claim that us modders are “stealing” their work, but in my mind, we get a free-pass because we are not charging for our creative ideas with these baseball video games. From my personal perspective, I don’t do this modding stuff from the “business” mindset or whatever…I mod this game for myself and I choose to share with everyone here (an I am happy to do so). It does stink that some other lazy people are making a buck (or YEN) off of our work, but Jim is doing the most viable thing by banning the suspect individuals from this site to hopefully minimize the issue.

[DonSPa]

im like dennis,i made these unis to make the game better,sure it be great to make money but its not why i do it and i wouldnt want to anyways because im sure 2k would feel the same way,if im making money off of thier product ,i dont think they would be happy.I dont mind if they are using my works on other sites,im glad they are because then more people are enjoying them,but at least give me credit and others whose mods are being used.But as it has been said there isnt much we can do and changing things here just makes it harder on trues and then people would complain because there were changes made.Then the next solution would be to close the site and no one wants that at all.i downloaded that korean patch thing and honestly im not all that impressed.Unless i missed something i really dont see anything new or unique

[udwph]

Thank you for all that have voiced their opinion. Jim825 Thank you for taking action. Thank you for having level reasoning.

But there is still a bigger picture here. In Japan they are selling our work and not just 2011 they also are selling 2009 and 2010. These are not download sites. These are not files being passed from one computer user to another. Its a store that sells bootleg DVD copies using the files we made from here. Yes right there is nothing we can really do about it now. But how to prevent or stop it from happening in the future. Yes you can ban people but he already has the files and then flaunted it in our face. The Japanese didn't do that and No one here even knew it was happening including me. From the way it looked to me it was not only 2k11 MLB. There was 6 DVD's for 2k10 MLB it looked like it kept updating as new roster changes were made. I was in a high pressure situation so I couldn't take the time to look more too many people in line behind me.

How the store worked they used Ipads they had stations over 50 ipads you just scroll the Ipad or search for what you wanted and then hit enter. A small printed paper spits out at you. At the counter there is a number board when your number is called you pick up your DVD and pay. There is NO art work just a plain DVD. They have station so you can check the DVD to make sure the files are on it. Its quick easy and the amount of games is outrageous. It was very overwhelming to say the least and I also think I was in shock seeing my work on the screen in front of me and the line of Japanese kids behind me. Most everything is in Japanese in the store and my Japanese is not fluent.

As for the DVD it was the game with different mods on it. It also had all the tools used to mod including tywiggins MLB2k Roster Editor with serial.

I am also against charging for mods. If guys want to do it and they can make money from it, that's fine, but I won't pay for mods and I'll never charge for any of mine. I create mods because I enjoy doing it and want to share with others, not as a way to make money.

For me I am also against charging for mods. I spent last year 2k10 learning how to make the mods. Why so I could use them in my game for myself. The same goes for 2k11 I learned more quickly this year on how to and decided to share what I made with others because of the level of difficulty the mods this year require. Now learning that my mods and uploads are not being just shared but also bootlegged and sold makes me angry.

Had I not shared my work then these people couldn't make money from me. For me this isn't about making money its about knowing the time I spent making my work is not exploited. I have in the back of my mind peace that someone, somewhere paid to use my work at least once before they ripped it off and exploited it. This goes be hound the enjoyment of making using and sharing for other people to enjoy now knowing what I know.

I now have to think about the next files I share and upload when I hit that button who will download and exploit my work.

Thank you for your thoughts and as a community in dealing with this.

William

aka udwph

[DonSPa]

well because they are doing this it isnt gonna stop me from doing and sharing work.There will be thousands of people who wont even know who did the work anyways if they dont come on this site,but everyone who does come on this site WILL know and for me thats all that matters anyways.I know this isnt the only time this happens,im sure every modded game this kind of thing goes on.In some ways im flattered to think that someone thought my works was good enough to put on disc and share,yes even though it sux some one makes money off what i did and i dont see any of that lol,thats where i have to just be humble and not let it worry me too much.Its the people who come on this site who will leave me a note saying good job,i love ur work or pm me and ask me to do something special that they are the only people in the world who have some of these special works(unless they passed it off) lolol.I know my works are not exactly the most professional but still works that people like.The people on this site will be the reason i continue to do the works as long as i am able

[Yankee4Life]

But there is still a bigger picture here. In Japan they are selling our work and not just 2011 they also are selling 2009 and 2010. These are not download sites. These are not files being passed from one computer user to another. Its a store that sells bootleg DVD copies using the files we made from here. Yes right there is nothing we can really do about it now. But how to prevent or stop it from happening in the future. Yes you can ban people but he already has the files and then flaunted it in our face. The Japanese didn't do that and No one here even knew it was happening including me. From the way it looked to me it was not only 2k11 MLB. There was 6 DVD's for 2k10 MLB it looked like it kept updating as new roster changes were made. I was in a high pressure situation so I couldn't take the time to look more too many people in line behind me.

How the store worked they used Ipads they had stations over 50 ipads you just scroll the Ipad or search for what you wanted and then hit enter. A small printed paper spits out at you. At the counter there is a number board when your number is called you pick up your DVD and pay. There is NO art work just a plain DVD. They have station so you can check the DVD to make sure the files are on it. Its quick easy and the amount of games is outrageous. It was very overwhelming to say the least and I also think I was in shock seeing my work on the screen in front of me and the line of Japanese kids behind me. Most everything is in Japanese in the store and my Japanese is not fluent.

As for the DVD it was the game with different mods on it. It also had all the tools used to mod including tywiggins MLB2k Roster Editor with serial.

This sounds like one hell of a store. Now that I think about it, this stuff must have been going on for quite a long time. I'm sure you can find mods being sold there for Mvp 2004 and 2005.

Sorry to say but there is nothing that can be done about this from anyone on this site except the extreme, and that's to ban everyone from every Asian country. But of course, that wouldn't be fair to the ones who don't do this kind of stuff.

[udwph]

View Postudwph, on 30 May 2011 - 10:54 AM, said:udwph

We paid to be a member here and to download. tywiggins charges for his editor there is nothing in the Forum Rules that says we can't (unless I missed something).

That's not true. If you made a donation to the site, it was to get unlimited downloads. Trues implemented this as a way to try to raise some money to keep up with the monthly costs to keep the site alive. No one was forced to donate. If they did not donate, they could still download files. They were just limited to 2 downloads per day. Trues did away with this when he moved the site to a new server last year.That's not true. If you made a donation to the site, it was to get unlimited downloads. Trues implemented this as a way to try to raise some money to keep up with the monthly costs to keep the site alive. No one was forced to donate. If they did not donate, they could still download files. They were just limited to 2 downloads per day. Trues did away with this when he moved the site to a new server last year.

No I bought a subscription when I joined its clearly worded not worded donation. Yes it may of read on paypal as a donation I don't remember but this is listed and posted when I joined. It has now changed but when I joined this site it was clearly worded and read:

Starting immediately, new and regular members (only) will be limited to (2) downloads per day or they can choose one of the following paid subscriptions in order to gain full access (no restrictions) to the downloads section (among other features). Please note: this is NOT a charge for individual files but an overall charge to cover the cost of bandwidth and space required to host these files.

If you are a modder, you'll automatically receive a lifetime subscription. If you are a current contributor, you will also receive a lifetime subscription and upgraded to the new "contributors +" group.

Once the server costs are reached each month, the rest will go into a pool to cover the next month and so on. Hopefully, this will allow us to continue to exist and grow for the foreseeable future.

Thanks again for your continued support.

You can access the following subscriptions from your control panel, under options.

Basic Plan: $5 (yearly subscription)

· Full access (no restrictions) to our downloads section with over 3900 files.

· Full shoutbox access.

· Private message storage increased from 25 (standard) to 100.

· Contributor status indicated with your name in blue.

Plus Plan: $10 (lifetime subscription)

· Full access (no restrictions) to our downloads section with over 3900 files.

· Full shoutbox access.

· Private message storage increased to 200.

· Mass PM ability. (up to 5 people at one time)

· Personal title.

· The ability to change your username (up to 2 per year).

· Contributor + status indicated with your name in gold.

Anyway this is all trivial. The reason we joined, donated or subscripted was to be apart of this mod community. To share and learn and to enjoy and have fun. I am with my friends all of you who voiced an opinion.

As for the store it was small the size of a living room open air meaning No walls on a corner easy access to the street. They sold every thing gamer including hot rodded gamer machines and every accessory possible made so much things in a small place. As for the amount of games or DVD files I don't know but there was a lot of things. I bought an old atari game module. It was expensive more that it retailed back in the day. Anyway if your in Tokyo the store is located on the south side of Shinjuku.

[Yankee4Life]

So what if it did say that? That's how things used to be in here. Whether you bought a subscription or not has nothing to do with what you are talking about with those people selling the mods.

How can Trues or anyone else police what goes on in Japan? That's insane. All this site can do is protect the modders on this site and that's it.

[udwph]

So what if it did say that? That's how things used to be in here. Whether you bought a subscription or not has nothing to do with what you are talking about with those people selling the mods.

How can Trues or anyone else police what goes on in Japan? That's insane. All this site can do is protect the modders on this site and that's it.

Yankee4Life I was just relping to what Jim825 the ADIM to this site had to say and about the difference between then and now and what I paid for when I joined. I didn't make a donation as he stated. That is all!!!

Your right about policing anywhere else that is not my concern that has already happened and there is nothing that can be done about it.

My concern is.........

How to protect us and our work on here a member a modder a person who enjoys sharing for FREE and not be exploited and my main concern is just that.

But it hasn't happened has it?

The question still remains how to fix the problem if your ok with it then nothing lost for you. I wasn't attacking anyone just making others aware. That is why I started this post because I paid to use this site. If the whole site and all its features were free with NO disclaimers that is different also and different point all together. But that's not the case.

The bottom line is we paid...... Yes we have a choice to pay or not and to whom and where the money went and how much this site generates is not my concern and I don't really care that's not the point Jim825 brought it in to discussion when he said what he said in his reply. I paid because I think this site is great and have made friends and enjoy everyone and want to make sure it's always here and for the next generation of gamers like my son.

Jim825 is the main man he has the power and controls this I would expect that he should protect its members and content and take care of problems that a raise. Temporarily the solution is solved and that is what matters.

What is the next step go on as normal like not knowing with blinders? If everyone is fine with that then fine I did what I thought was right in sharing what I know and what I have seen. For me I felt different.

Thank you for your thoughts I am only trying to make the members, modders and users aware.

[Trues]

It sucks that this is happening, but that's the internet for ya. No way around it.

[Jim825]

OK, you're right. I shouldn't have used the word "donate." I was just trying to point out that your statement wasn't completely true:

I paid to be a member and download from this site.

You purchased a subscription for unlimited downloads, and not a membership fee. What you did was voluntary (which is why I used the word "donation"), and not required in order to download mods. As it said in the text you quoted, you still could have downloaded two files each day without purchasing a subscription.

I know I'm getting off the subject here, but I wanted to clarify my original post.

As far as the subject of this thread, I agree that it isn't right that our work is being sold elsewhere, but about the only thing I can tell you is that if you don't want someone to steal your work, don't upload it. That may sound harsh, but I don't really know what else to tell you.

You've raised a number of possible solutions, however, everything you've proposed is much more work than anyone here would be willing to undertake. I know this isn't the answer you're looking for, but as I said, I don't know what else to tell you.

Jim825 is the main man he has the power and controls this I would expect that he should protect its members and content and take care of problems that a raise. Temporarily the solution is solved and that is what matters.

Power and controls??? What power do I have. Yes, I can ban members, and approve or disapprove mods, but beyond that, I don't know what power or controls I have. I have no way to control what happens to a mod once its downloaded. I also don't get paid enough (wait a minute, I don't get paid at all!) to scour the Internet looking for these mods posted on other places. Again, if what we do here isn't good enough, just don't post your mods.

[Yankee4Life]

The question still remains how to fix the problem if your ok with it then nothing lost for you. I wasn't attacking anyone just making others aware. That is why I started this post because I paid to use this site. If the whole site and all its features were free with NO disclaimers that is different also and different point all together. But that's not the case.

I'm not "ok with it." So don't go assuming that I am.

What you seem to be overlooking is what could the site here at Mvpmods.com do about what is going on in Japan? What could they do today, RIGHT NOW, to prevent this? Nothing, and that is the sad reality about it. Now let me ask you this. What the hell could you do if you were in charge of this site and how would you prevent this from happening? You couldn't. Because if they want to be here to download the latest stuff that you guys make, then they will. And then they'll repackage it up and sell it some more. You know how you stop them? By not having this website. Then they won't have any place to go to get the mods. And no one wants that.

The bottom line is we paid...... Yes we have a choice to pay or not and to whom and where the money went and how much this site generates is not my concern and I don't really care that's not the point Jim825 brought it in to discussion when he said what he said in his reply. I paid because I think this site is great and have made friends and enjoy everyone and want to make sure it's always here and for the next generation of gamers like my son.

You paid for the rights to have unlimited downloads when there was a time when downloads were restricted per user. And I'll tell you where the money went from your donation and everyone else that donated. It went right back to the site to pay for the costs running the site. Where else do you think it was going to go?

Jim825 is the main man he has the power and controls this I would expect that he should protect its members and content and take care of problems that a raise. Temporarily the solution is solved and that is what matters.

What is the next step go on as normal like not knowing with blinders? If everyone is fine with that then fine I did what I thought was right in sharing what I know and what I have seen. For me I felt different.

Again I ask you, how is Jim supposed to "protect" you? Should he get on a plane and go to Japan and tell those people that what they are doing is wrong? He can only make sure your work is not stolen from people on this site that try to pass it off as their own. That's it. You are expecting too much out of him.

[Jim825]

Again I ask you, how is Jim supposed to "protect" you? Should he get on a plane and go to Japan and tell those people that what they are doing is wrong? He can only make sure your work is not stolen from people on this site that try to pass it off as their own. That's it. You are expecting too much out of him.

If Trues will let me submit an expense report to MVPMods to pay for my flights (business class) and a hotel, I will go. Unfortunately, this week isn't good for me, as my middle daughter graduates high school on Thursday and we've got plans next weekend.

Let's see what Trues says and then I'll look at my calendar.... :facepalm:

[udwph]

Yankee4Life this isn't about what we paid for and where the money goes that is a NO Brainier!!!! Jim825 corrected and explained himself I am ok with that.

I don't except anyone here to do anything or go anywhere. That is not the point it was to make people aware of what has and will continue to happen and is there an easy way to make sure it doesn't continue to happen. The answer seems to be No just don't post your work. What would I do if this was my site? Well it isn't and I did what I thought was the right thing to do!!!!

Share what I know and start a forum so everyone who has uploaded work can talk and discuses and decide and then the powers to be the owner Trues and the admin Jim825 can help change or make a difference together as a community we decide what to do. What happens to this site is not my direct responsibility but my uploads are my direct responsibility as stated.

Jim825 you are the man with the power!!

My only concern is the members on this site and their work. They have worked hard to share.

Oh well we shall wait and see...........

Hey Jim825 its not only Japan its Korea also!!!! Round trip all around!!!

[udwph]

If Trues will let me submit an expense report to MVPMods to pay for my flights (business class) and a hotel, I will go. Unfortunately, this week isn't good for me, as my middle daughter graduates high school on Thursday and we've got plans next weekend.

Let's see what Trues says and then I'll look at my calendar....

On the way back you can visit me here in Thailand and enjoy the beaches, stay at my beach house for free!!!! Or make a donation........... Serious now!!!

[Yankee4Life]

Once the file is downloaded its not this sites responsibility but isn't each file uploaded suppose to be approved? But once again that isn't the problem either.

Yeah it does have to be approved. It has to be approved for posting on this site. But I fail to see what the hell this has to do with you preventing this from happening.

[udwph]

udwph, on 31 May 2011 - 09:57 AM, said:

Once the file is downloaded its not this sites responsibility but isn't each file uploaded suppose to be approved? But once again that isn't the problem either.

Yeah it does have to be approved. It has to be approved for posting on this site. But I fail to see what the hell this has to do with you preventing this from happening.

Please read the whole thread..........

[Luke45]

I think this community are not successful or mods or anything claiming to be selfish and all ... if they see the pages of mods pro evolution soccer patch thousands of accessories and editors mods because those who do, do it to share the world not to fill with money, such as that in a pro evolution soccer editor can edit all players who are much more than the mlb2k and can be used for unlimited day and not have to pay, do so with the idea that this would be vallan becoming more and more mods, fixes and improvements for the benefit of all ... editing pages should be to share the creations and improvements that everyone can do to have better games to bring them no limits or anything like that ... is my opinion ... and sorry for my bad English I'm using a translator ... Greetings ...

[StormsWarning]

ya'know as i've read over all these comments, questions, and concerns, in reality it all boils down to to things, 1 closing this site or 2, not loading up mods on here for people to enjoy. notice the key words ? ( reality ) ( people to enjoy )

i've been a member here a good while, alot longer than my actual join date shows, and i can say that this situation is not new under the sun, i can rember a time when mvp 05 was going on ebay for more than 500 dollars, now you can say that's an insane amount of money to pay for a game, but when demand is high for a game that is in short supply, well...anything is possible and people will pay it.

the mods that was made here, were so awesome it was seriously threating the developer's in gaming consoles, the guys here have made so many outstanding mods, even still todate with the classic's alone is worth the price of admission.

ud, i understand your gripe with safalove, what he did was wrong, but theres nothing you can do to stop future endevors bro.

people have tryed to take mvp mods and make money for years, some might have, some might not have, but in my key words that i underlined, it gets back to the main focus, this community will always be a community in enjoying the talk/chat and the great mods delievered on here, no matter who trys to steal whatever, at the end of the day people are going to be people,

which leads back to that other word i underlined, in reality, in our world, as i'm sure where all aware of, you have some good people, and you have some bad, sometimes it seems that the bad is always overwhelming the good, but at the end of the day, those thats choosen to do the good seem to always prevail, meaning Dont Let Lames Stop You From Enjoying What You Do!

i downloaded, the mod that safa, put out, outside of a turf.dirt mod there was nothing else to that mod ( literally) that i'd say was outgoing or earth shattering, pick up the 1956 mod for mvp baseball, now you'll see some earth shattering mods in that game!, personal, Jim done the right thing by banning that clown, but as he and many others know, that wont stop what goes on, in the end you cant punish the whole world for a few dumb people.

all in all, enjoy life bro, enjoy what your creation brings to people that can appreciate the art!

on a side note, just wanted to say wasup to my dude True's, long time man, it's good to see you around in some topics here and there. how bout them Indians ...;0

Storm.